Summer League II Final

[sturmgeist]

Open:
1st Roy 46pts
2nd Dustin 45pts
3rd Jeff 36pts
4th Neal 29pts
5th James 29pts
6th Brian 27pts
7th Rufus 26pts
8th Allan 23pts
9th Danny 19pts

Int:
1st Will 13pts
2nd Thad 10pts
3rd Kenny 9pts

ACE POT = $52

---------------

Round 4

Open:
Neal 53 17pts
Roy 56 15pts
James 58 13pts
Jeff 60 11pts
Dustin 61 9pts Drop
Danny 62 7pts
Brian 63 5pts
Rufus 64 3pts
Allan Drop

Int:
Will 59 5pts
Kenny 60 3pts
Thad 63 1pt

-------------------
Round 3

Open:
Roy 59 16pts
Dustin 59 16pts
James 60 13pts
Jeff 61 11pts Drop
Neal 65 7pts
Allan 65 7pts
Brian 65 7pts
Rufus -- 0pts DROP
Danny -- 0pts DROP

Int:
Kenny 63 5pts
Thad 71 2pts
Will 71 2pts

-------------------
Round 2

Open:
Roy 52 15pts
Dustin 52 15pts
Brian 52 15pts
Jeff 54 11pts
Rufus 55 9pts
Allan 56 7pts
Danny 58 5pts
James 59 3pts
Neil 60 1pt Drop


Int:
Will 56 5pts
Thad 60 3pts
Kenny 61 1pts

---------------
Round I

Open
Rufus 51 14pts
Dustin 51 14pts
Roy 51 14pts Drop
Jeff 51 14pts
Alan 54 9pts
Danny 55 7pts
Neal 58 5pts
James 59 3pt Drop
Brian -- 0pts Drop

Int
Thad 55 5pts
Will 58 3pts
Kenny 59 1pt

[sturmgeist]

League party will be this saturday at the island, around noon.

[sturmgeist]

There was a mixup on the cards yesterday and I have a bit of a shocker announcement. These are always fun.

Jeff's score was incorrectly added on the card. I always add the cards myself before I post just to double check everything. The card has his score listed as a 60. The tally for his score was ACTUALLY 58. So I corrected for this and went about my business. Upon further examination though, it is my duty to add a 2 stroke penalty to the incorrect score, making it again, a 60.

This changes the points, and puts James and Neal in a tie for 4th overall. They will playoff for their place at a time convenient to both of them. Either at the league party this saturday, if both attend, or the next time they meet and consent to the playoff.

I apologize for any inconvenience, and whoever added up Roy, Dustin, Jeff, and Rufus' card, you made things more interesting, for sure.

[chessguy]

Good job, Will. Please check on the legitimacy of changing posted final results. :) Since you're doing things by the book and all.

[fuzzy]

No need to check on that Will. You did it correctly.

[fuzzy]

Hey Neal, instead of being unbeleivably lazy and posting this stuff on the PDGA board...why dont you pick up the rule book and try reading it yourself. I'd point the rule to you but i think it would be better for you to actually read and know the rules, especially before implying someone is cheating you.

[sturmgeist]

I checked it before I did it, I wouldn't have posted it not knowing it was right. 804.03

G. After the scorecard is turned in, the total score as recorded shall stand with no appeal, except for the following circumstances:

(1)Penalty throws may be assessed at whatever time the infraction is discovered until the director declares the tournament officially over or all awards have been distributed.

(2)If it is determined that the total score was incorrectly recorded, either by an error on a hole score or by an error in totaling the hole scores, including omission of the total score, the director shall add two penalty throws to the correct total score. These penalty throws are not added when the TD(or an official designated by the TD, such as a course director) corrects a player's score for other infractions determined after this player had turned in an otherwise correct scorecard.

This is the second time since I've been doing league that I've had to invoke 804.03 G... you guys need to get off the scorecard infractions and give me something new to work with.

[chessguy]

I read the rules, Fuzzy. Although, I'm not much for reading. I would like to see the scorecard, however. Is that allowed?

Will, I wanted to know if you are intending to follow all PDGA rules and regulations during league play or are you picking and choosing?

I've discussed the matter with James and left the ball in his court as to whether he wants to tie for 4th cash on a "technicality". For the record, in a non-tournament situation as this, I'd not want to nor would I accept being bumped up a spot on a technicality where something other than what I shot compared to what someone else shot on the round(s) figured into final results.

The money doesn't matter here, the principal does. I'm sure Will is getting no enjoyment whatsoever out of this situation.

Gonna try not to get all worked up on this and keep in mind that...

a.) I shot the only round under par
b.) I beat everyone by at least 3 strokes
c.) I shot the only (to my knowledge) bogey-free round
d.) I left with the #3 tag
e.) I at least tied for 4th place cash after "taking" rounds with point totals of 5 and 7!!!
f.) I won a tournament last weekend
g.) I am blessed!

Peace

[Jrodisc]

WOW. This is interesting. I talked to Neal and he expected me to just say go ahead and take the payout since you won the last round. Well after looking at all the rounds for this league, we tied perfectly. 1st roud Neal beat me by one spot, 2nd I beat him by two spots, 3rd I beat him by one spot, and 4th he beat me by two spots. And as most of you know I'm all about playing it off. Declare a winner. So I'm sorry Neal, but the only way you're gonna see that payout is to beat me in a playoff. I'm sure Will will back me up on that. No offense Neal, but we tied. You don't deserve the payout anymore than I do.

[fuzzy]

None of those things mean anything accept to boost your ego.

You are bassakwards. You want to TAKE solo 4th off a technicality. You didnt earn 4th place no matter how you try to justify it in your mind (nothing you said matters AT ALL). According to the Scores, you tied for 4th place, had he not corrected his mistake then YOU would have taken 4th on a technicality. For some reason you think its okay to screw James over and I just dont get it. Seriously, you need to look at it for what it is....you earned a tie for 4th, nothing more. Hell be lucky you got that after playing like complete ass the three rounds prior. Seriously, stop being a selfish jackass and try to get on the planet everyone else is on where no one is out to get Neal. Sorry to sound so harsh but I just get tired of people, at every opportunity possible, trying to make life harder for someone who stepped up when NO ONE, including yourself, would step up and do what he is doing.

[chessguy]

Fuzzy, that's exactly why I called James and explained the situation and told him what I'd do and I stand by that. In a tournament where a TD has no discretion, that would be different. James, 4th place $ is yours. I decline any participation in a playoff for this.

I'll await Will's response as to whether he is following all PDGA rules and guidelines before I post anything further on the subject.

Peace

[CypressTrout]

Does he have to follow all PDGA rules if he's the TD ?? Seems like if he's the only one willing to run the tournies, he can use whatever rules he desires.

[el-jefe]

par 54? I shot 6 up, thats 60 huh? Im bettin you thought a 5 was a 3 because I know I shot 6 up. 6 up is a 60 and thats what I got either way. If it would have changed my score other than what I shot I would have protested and we would have had to go over the card hole by hole but luckily that didn't happen.

FGH%$^KNEELYETHETYY#%YEFGGWG#%YTHYYE%$^Y#%^HEGFEHT ENHYEJTYHDSRTGW$%^YR^UERHERN^RMIM(LK%^NB%VEESRYN&RY^&UM^NR^EUKNEELSRDTNEHMJ^I%J^$Y^WH$%#$H&JDSRETYH#KNEELsdfic2vnu54gvZLKJSDVLKEJNRTBO35IUTGB J9546NJGHD;KGIBEROITJH3E56I8JHassholeFVJUHNWE VASNDLFKJVALEJVLAKDJN CLKJZNLFJV. JUST COULDN'T SAY WHAT i WANTED TO SAY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!

Will, you are doing a good job. There are some things I would like to discuss with you at the party saturday. DWISE is making bbq burgers, I am going to bring some sausage and potatoe salad. Kenny is bringing a cheese cake, looks like we are eating good. see ya sat.

[el-jefe]

Fuzzy, that's exactly why I called James and explained the situation and told him what I'd do and I stand by that. In a tournament where a TD has no discretion, that would be different. James, 4th place $ is yours. I decline any participation in a playoff for this.

I'll await Will's response as to whether he is following all PDGA rules and guidelines before I post anything further on the subject.

Peace

you won't have anything to worry about.

[el-jefe]

I am glad I noticed that I can no longer edit my posts, Someone would have had to delete the post I was writing because of the sheer harshness of what I had written. somebody will need to monitor my posts and delete my first posts from now on because sometimes I post and reread and see that I shouldn't have posted something and tone it down. So now if it makes in on and I change my mind on the wording, I'll repost and whoever can take off the initial post. ........does that make sense? I know what I want to say but it dosent really sound right.

[dg]

Gonna try not to get all worked up on this and keep in mind that...

a.) I shot the only round under par
b.) I beat everyone by at least 3 strokes
c.) I shot the only (to my knowledge) bogey-free round

Peace

Although Dwight wasn't in league he beat you by a few strokes.

And please god quit writing PEACE at the end of your posts, its gay.

[dg]

I am glad I noticed that I can no longer edit my posts,

you should be able to edit your own posts, unless someone else has already edited it for you

[sturmgeist]

Scorecard has you at 58 Jeff, even though it reads 60 in the total. There's no mistake on my part. Two 4s, two 5s, and two 2s. That's 58. Whoever wrote the score was kind enough to write their numbers in such a way that none can be mistaken for another. Now, you have a M-3 on hole 6 that whoever tallied it might have mistaken for a 5 in the waning light, but it's very distinctly a mulligan 3, not a 5.

Either way it's a 60. But you shot 58 if the hole by hole tally is correct.

[sturmgeist]

John Johnson is gonna come out to the league party and try and get in on the next league. he said he was gonna bring a pack of ZUmmos if he makes it out. He works in a machine shop and I asked him about the difficulty of making baskets, and he said from the looks of them it's not anything too elaborate, and that he would be willing to talk to his boss about using the shop to construct some baskets in exchange for making some signs to put up to acknowledge them as course sponsors. I'm not holding my breath over it, but it sure would be awesome to get a set of baskets for the cost of materials...

As far as rules and such Neal, I'm not going to discuss it here. Don't post about it again. Bring it up at the league party and I'll discuss it further there. Don't forget now.

[el-jefe]

3 5's on the day

[sturmgeist]

Dustin also said you birdied more holes than the card shows. Doesn't matter though, once it's turned in I can only go by what's written down, and the individual hole scores have priority over the recorded total. Funny to be arguing about it cause you get a 60 either way.

[chessguy]

Once again, I hope that those affected by the score can see the card. That seems quite fair. I'm sure that sucker will be pencil whipped like nothing else, though!!!

Will, I just asked you a simiple question and now you shy away from it. It has to do with how you are running league and is a fair question for this forum.

ARE YOU FOLLOWING ALL PDGA RULES AND REGULATIONS DURING LEAGUE PLAY?

I think it's a cryin' shame that our league has gotten to the point where we are so serious that people are getting penalized on their scores when they are not purposefully circumventing the rules of disc golf. I mean I suppose you'd stroke a new dg'er for entering their score wrong. I'm sure they'd just love that!

2 strokes??? C'mon!!! Jeff, while I appreciate your attempt at refraining yourself from being childish, I can't imagine you miscounting your score by freakin' 2 not 1 but 2 strokes. Surely you didn't know that would throw James into a tie with me?!

Once again, I'll await your response to that simple question before I post anything else on the subject.

Hey, James, remember a certain 1 footer I missed on hole 18 at the Island? ;)

Meanwhile, I'll be unable once again to attend the festivities due to a scheduled tournament.

Have a nice summer!

[el-jefe]

Thats what I said. I played like shit and had 3 double bogeys on the day, a couple of bogeys and a couple of birdies toward the end. DG wouldn't know, he was trying to keep up with his bogeys! :) If I remember right, I was 6 up on 15 and went par bogey birdie par. See ya sat.

[el-jefe]

"Dude you should know how to add your score up by now. good grief! You realize this makes you look suspicious. "

Thought it would be funny to post this part of the pm Kneel sent me. Especially after he tried to steal 4th place payout.

-power of the dark lord be with you.

[CypressTrout]

I'm sure that sucker will be pencil whipped like nothing else, though!!!

Aren't you the king of pencil whipping ?? I wish I had a dollar for every time someone commented on you lying about your score.


I think it's a cryin' shame that our league has gotten to the point where we are so serious that people are getting penalized on their scores when they are not purposefully circumventing the rules of disc golf. I mean I suppose you'd stroke a new dg'er for entering their score wrong. I'm sure they'd just love that!

Again, you didn't step up to run league, so play & deal with it or stfu about how it's being run.


Hey, James, remember a certain 1 footer I missed on hole 18 at the Island? ;)

Do you keep a log of all of your shots that happen to luck INTO the basket ?? From the times I've played w/you, those far outweigh the short misses.

Meanwhile, I'll be unable once again to attend the festivities due to a scheduled tournament.


You probably unconciously just made everyone's day.

[chessguy]

Good day to you, Kevin.

The one footer I mentioned was a little inside the 2 footer I threw at the basket for an intentional miss on 14 at the Island on Dustin's card several weeks back. They weren't accidents. That post was for James who was making such a point of how he won 2 rounds and I won 2 that league yet ended up 1 pt. behind on the round totals. Oh, wait. Something mysteriously was thrown in there that had nothing to do with how we shot on the rounds.

Still waiting on Will's response on whether or not he is following all PDGA rules and regulations during league play.

Yeah, I guess a 63 was just too good for me to "really" shoot on Wilmont at that time.

No, Kevin, I don't think I'll stfu and Obey you. I have a question about league and that is my right.

Do you guys have a date lined up?

[fuzzy]

Neal, I told you the other day not to worry about being banned from club events becasue i didnt think everyone would go for that. In the last two days you have changed my mind. Your paranoia and accusations are uncalled for and should not be tolerated anymore. If i have some sort of vote whether you should be able to continue playing club events then I will vote against you. You make life unbearable for those who graciously volunteer their time and it has to end. You completely take the fun factor out of league events with all your garbage. I wont be lobbying to get others to ban you, i will let them decide for themselves.

I am also an admin on this site and I will start to remove all future posts where you accuse people of things that are totally made up in your head. Make that hard for me and I will push for you to be banned from the site.

Bottomline here is that you need to stop, now.

[el-jefe]

wow word travels fast. I was going to wait for the club meeting but since the cats out of the bag here it goes.

I am proposing that Kneel be banned from the club and events hosted by the club including league, bag tag challenge, players championship, and any other event sanctioned or unsanctioned by the pdga that is run by the club. I will no longer tolerate the behavior of a child like Kneel. Everything would be hunky dory if it werent for the one thorn that has ended up stuck in everyone more than once. This is not discrimination against Kneel because I have tolerated him for this long but his actions in the last few weeks.... what am I saying....his actions have brought me to the boiling point and something has to be done. So think long and hard between now and the party and decide if kneel is a positive for the club or a negative. The vote will be done on note cards and annonymous.

[sturmgeist]

Neal, there was an ERROR, either in the totaling of the score, or the recording of the score, and either way it's a two stroke penalty for the score in question. You want to win on a technicality like a scoring error, but you don't want someone else to be given a fair shake over that same technicality, or specifically, it's correction. Nobody is screwing you Neal, I'm just refusing to screw James. You've got a chance to win the place outright, just the same as a tournament. Quit whining.

Any other questions you WILL hold untill the next time you are at a scheduled league event. I won't answer your questions at any other time or in any other format.

[el-jefe]

Kneel,
since you are again going to be missing at the league party and meeting, you might want to take the time to start a thread to explain your actions and put up some sort of defense. I don't want you to say you didn't get a chance. I will print up your defense and pass it out at the meeting so that those who don't check the web site will get a chance to review your statements.

[Jrodisc]

First off, Neal, if you want to bring up that little putt you missed on purpose then go ahead. You say it like that means you gave me that round, but what it really means is you gave me 4th place in league. Good move genius. As far as banning you from gtdiscgolf thats not my place. Honestly speaking I would've enjoyed a lot of rounds in the past that I didn't because of your loud mouth. Whatever insecurities you've been holding on to since your childhood is causing people to resent you. If you would just step out of the box and look at how you make yourself seem you might realize you seem like a jackass. Deep down I think you're not a bad guy but on the exterior ...........well you get the point. Just try not to be an idiot before they ban you dude.

[el-jefe]

I had fun today, good golf good food good people what better way to spend a sat. Summer league series 3 starts up wednesday and we have 2 new players in the rec division, Chris and John. Lets see if we can't recruit a few more new players to join in, maybe a couple of those vidor guys can make it out and we can boost up rec to 4 or 5.

[sturmgeist]

Straight from the PDGA Rules and Standards messageboard, where Neal posted a very shallow explanation of what happened this week:

bruce_brakel
Re: Changing results once posted??? [Re: chessguy]

There are no rules for league.

--------------------

gnduke(gary duke)
Re: Changing results once posted??? [Re: bruce_brakel]

True, but had it been a sanctioned event, penalty strokes can be added until the event is declared over and all prizes have been awarded.

I don't think there is a time limit for the correction of TD scoring errors.

--------------------

11k_and_Counting (Rhett Stroh)
Re: Changing results once posted??? [Re: bruce_brakel]

Quote:
There are no rules for league.


There is one rule for league: You do things however the League Czar decides to do things.

Now, after all that's happened, I think it's going to be necessary to make a few official declarations on how league is handled.

1) League is over when the awards are handed out at the league end player's party. Posting of scores to the internet does NOT signify any finality if for no other reason than there is a minority of players who peruse the site. I post the results here as a courtesy to the players who DO use the site, not as an official end to the event. That's done at the players party, where all can attend, and that way ample time is given to contest any scores and standings.

2) Players will attend a brief players meeting before each round of league. Details such as mandos, drop zones, alterations to holes and tees, and any stipulations will be explained by the director, and noted by the players.

3) The question of rules: rules will be enforced on the side of the spirit of the sport, rather than the letter of the law. We are not in an area with a strong population of pros or serious advanced players(no offense) and competition will be kept as casual as possible within the bounds of practicality. I am not expecting nor asking people to call fouls on every possible stance violation, foot fault, etc, nor am I requiring a declaration of lost disc and the countdown that goes with it. I will encourage players to make use of the courtesy violation call, where applicable - if players refuse to help in the search for a lost disc, for example, or a player is continually harassing another in ill spirit, making loud annoying noises during another's throws, etc.

4) The one major exception to the strictness of the rules is that of scoring. Scoring is the backbone of the sport, and correct scoring is essential to competition. Players in charge of the score card are to follow the full rules of scoring - call the player in questions name, ask for their stroke count, listen for the stroke count and repeat it to the player for confirmation. This takes no more time really than asking "Was that an all star par?" Scorecard inconsistancies/errors/violations put me, as league director, at an inconvenience, because I have to figure and refigure, and decide what to do about the situations. I have had to deal with scorecard violations in both leagues now, and with a little care, that can all be avoided. Nobody is perfect, but your scorecards sure as hell ought to be.

5) Just like at any store, management reserves the right to refuse service.

If anyone can think of anything that should be brought to attention here, please do so.

[el-jefe]

you forgot this one.
All decisions made by the LD are final(period).

[CypressTrout]

He just got a response.....:)

[sturmgeist]

Damn Willis, thanks, you're chokin me up over here.

[el-jefe]

huh??

[chessguy]

Will, I need to get the discs of mine you have.

Still wondering whether you are abiding by all PDGA rules and regulations.

You know, things like practice throws, people not marking their putts, people picking up other peoples disc before they've holed out, people not holing out, hurling minis, illegal substances, falling putts?

Hold on to that score card, will ya. I'd like to see it.

I simply told James what I'd have done and its fine you assessing the 2 stroke penalty, Will. It doesn't make me happy but I'll get over that. I just wanted you to answer that one question. Despite the 2 stroke penalty, I beat James on what I actually shot so I'm content with that.

Besides, I hit my 17th Ace this weekend. Some may call it a quadruple circle 9. lol

I enjoyed league while it lasted guys. You are all under Jeff's control. The website and disc golf are two different things. I've always had a great time playing dg with everyone and gee I'd hope as adults if someone had a problem with me that they'd bring it to my attention so I could tend to whatever was bothering them. I'm not here to please any of you. I have a family and a career and I live a disc golfers dream traveling to new and exciting courses for tournaments with my son. This wouldn't have anything to do with jealousy would it? lmao

Peace

[sturmgeist]

Of those that spin out trifles and die without a memorial, many flatter themselves with high opinions of their own importance, and imagine that they are every day adding some improvement to human life.

Every man is of importance to himself, and, therefore, in his own opinion, to others; and, supposing the world already acquainted with his pleasures and his pains, is perhaps the first to publish injuries or misfortunes which had never been known unless related by himself, and at which those that hear them will only laugh, for no man sympathises with the sorrows of vanity.

-Samuel Johnson

[el-jefe]

its been brought to your attention time and time again.

[sturmgeist]

Selective amnesia maybe?

[el-jefe]

series 3 begins wednesday. good luck to all. New payout format will be introduced this series, look for more details to come.

[chessguy]

I hadn't read Will's post about the within the spirit of the game and stuff when I posted again about following all PDGA rules. Did go back and read it. Am clear now. I know you had to add the strokes, Will. Just seemed like you were getting an evil kick out of that "discovery" while we were on IM. When I mentioned the card being pencil-whipped, I wasn't implying that you were cheating. I don't think you'd ever do that, especially to your good buddy, Neal. Just didn't know if you were erasing a 60 then putting 58 then putting 60 again. I'd still like to see the card at some time just for shits n giggles. 3 5's and 2 deuces wasn't it, Jeff? Sounds like a 58 to me. I got the redemption I needed on the round after stinking it up in the elements the 1st three rounds. Just an incredibly ironic, odd, and yes, curious turn of events. I have no way of knowing whether Jeff took the time to see how the points would play out but I did see him with both cards at the table after the round for some time. three 5's and 2 deuces should not be that hard to add up is all I'm sayin' and the timing of it all is bizarre. I mean one week before this, Jeff announces that he'd like to get me black listed from participating in club events and then some "honest" mistake by him which I suppose I'm the only one who thinks is curious is thrown into the mix. No competetive golf for me for 2 weeks but back on the road after that. Gotta do some painting.

Peace be with all of you and I hope we can work this all out. Dustin or Roy, I hope to hear from either of you maybe in a PM or a phone call as to what actually took place concerning me at the League Party.

[sturmgeist]

No, no kick out of it, more of a sense of dread, cause I knew something would come of it. I DID anticipate watching a good playoff, but that was the extent of it.

There are no eraser marks on the card and no scratchouts, except a par turned 4 on hole 17 for Roy, and the totals for the front 9 were erased, not that that matters at all.

There was no vote taken over your status in the club Neal, but there was a nearly unanimous consensus that something has to be done to penalize your constant unsportsmanlike conduct and it was decided to delegate the responsibility over to me, as League Director, as the person who, over the course of the last two leagues, has come under fire of your inflammatory, slanderous accusations the most. So, it's a free country, and these are public parks - I can't keep you from showing up, but your entry to subsequent leagues will be denied indefinitely.

My job, first and foremost, is to try and make league play as fun as possible for everyone participating. Otherwise nobody will want to play. You're a sore loser, and an even worse winner, critical and jeering of the young, the old, the rookie and veteran player alike. It's a tough call to make, and I don't take any personal pleasure in it, but at the same time it's a no brainer - it's the quickest means to making the most players happy. I'm sorry it came to this, I never thought you'd get that far out of line.

[sturmgeist]

And yes, I erased a 60, put a 58(the corrected score) then replaced that with a 60, the corrected score with the added 2 stroke penalty for having an incorrect score in the first place.

[chessguy]

but there was a nearly unanimous consensus that something has to be done to penalize your constant unsportsmanlike conduct

Please elaborate about my "unsportsmanlike conduct".

[sturmgeist]

I'd rather not. Everyone knows your exploits without the need to indulge you by chronicling them yet again.

[chessguy]

Will, could we please meet to discuss the matter? I do enjoy League and I know the Open players will miss the competition. I would like the opportunity to make everything right and I'll gladly take responsibility for anything I've done wrong.

[sturmgeist]

Show up at a league day early if you want to discuss league. I'll only do it on league days with the other players around because it concerns them too.

[chessguy]

O.K. cool. I was gonna show up yesterday to read a short statement but then the rain came. I'll try again next Wednesday. I do have some things on a personal level I'd like to discuss with you, however. Ya'll check out discgolftv.com and find Cale Leveiska's shot of the day putt to force a playoff with Climo. Is a good one!!!

[sturmgeist]

A personal level? If they're about league, then they're not personal. You've tried to make them very personal, but I'm all bidnis on the subject of league. I really didn't want to post that about your league status on the board, but when I went to private message you, I couldn't. Either they're disabled or you switched them off, I don't know. But despite everything that's happened, I still didn't want you driving all the way out to the park to play only to find that out without some sort of heads up.

[el-jefe]

funny stuff on that pdga forum. Ive never seen everyone agree on a topic on the forum. I bet its the first time ever.

[lester]

http://campustechnology.com/articles/40733_1/

[el-jefe]

I agree with some of Terry's observations on trends of forums, but I can not stand his extremely liberal viewpoints and conclusions based on his political and social philosophies. We exchanged several emails with one another last year because of some of his "examples" of behaviors and his associating them with conservatives and republicans that he used on the pdga forums. He does it again in this article. I personally think he is an idiot or should I say a "useful idiot."

by the way, he accused me on the pdga forum of being a "swift boater" because I quoted his "examples" and called him out on his insensitivity of conservatives and "right-wingers"

[sturmgeist]

He's right. They demonstrate the behaviour not only on forums, not only between youngsters, but grown adults like Rush Limbaugh, Ayn Rand on national television and publications. Even our vice president has been caught cursing people out on the senate floor. That's displaying the behaviour all the way at the very top. Republicans are one thing, Conservatives are another - a vocal, belligerent, and generally ignorant minority, albeit extremely strategically distributed as far as voting districts go.

Now see the difference there Jeff? You don't like what that guy has to say so you call him an idiot. You prove his point for him.

[el-jefe]

If you read the crap he emailed youd think of him as an idiot also....socialist bastard. I think Fuzzy has had problems also.

Who dosen't cuss?

lets generalize.....
people without jobs are bums
mexicans are greasy
american indians are alcoholics
ummmm quote from limbaugh?
Although I did like when ann coulter called edwards a faggot during a speech.

wasnt it kerry caught dropping the f bomb on camera talking about republicans?
I know you are smarter than that Will. You do not usually generalize like that. I have been to many a fundraisers for both dems and rep candidate and they are all human and cuss and drink. Probably the only politician I would trust is ole Judge Poe....Good man.

Go on a lib blog and say global warming dosen't exist and that we should put another 50 thousand troops on the ground in the middle east and read the backlash......it aint nice.

[el-jefe]

damn I still cant edit my posts. lets start another thread and talk about politics and whos worse.... Me or them. :)

[el-jefe]

P.S. watch out for those black choppers.

[sturmgeist]

Just because something is said in general doesn't demean it's validity. Here's a generalization - the ONLY thing the Right wing has ever gotten right is the staunch support of the right to bear arms. And that alone is important enough to let them stick around a bit longer.

[sturmgeist]

And there you go, Ann Coulter is who I had in mind. Been reading online literature recently and Ayn Rand's name was fresh on my mind.

Really have no interest in discussing politics, I'd rather discuss something I enjoy. But pop up with those types of statements and I'll make a comment now and again. Politics are the slow acting poison that began killing America when the first political parties split from each other, in spite of Washington's warnings.

[Tomwin]

damn I still cant edit my posts. lets start another thread and talk about politics and whos worse.... Me or them. :)

You can edit your own posts in the general forums, but not in the News, Events, Results and Hole in one forums.

[dg]

there are tasteless vermin in every race, culture, religion and political affiliation on earth

[el-jefe]

Ok......but as a conservative libertarian I see the parties as they are. And neither are acceptable. Democrats however have moved toward full on socialism and that is unacceptable in the land of the free. I am all for darwinism and evolution, parts of the theory would fix our social ills if we allowed nature to do its thing and made people responsible for their actions. But in a liberal world, its always someone elses fault and we(tax payers also known as people who work) have to support the lazy through housing, food and reeducation(most didn't take advantage of the first free education offered) and that means I have to work 3 monthes to pay my taxes before I start putting money in my pocket.

[dg]

Ok......but as a conservative libertarian I see the parties as they are. And neither are acceptable. Democrats however have moved toward full on socialism and that is unacceptable in the land of the free. I am all for darwinism and evolution, parts of the theory would fix our social ills if we allowed nature to do its thing and made people responsible for their actions. But in a liberal world, its always someone elses fault and we(tax payers also known as people who work) have to support the lazy through housing, food and reeducation(most didn't take advantage of the first free education offered) and that means I have to work 3 monthes to pay my taxes before I start putting money in my pocket.

you should just quit working and draw welfare jefe, with your kids you ought to bring in a nice check

[el-jefe]

We need term limits in this country for our senators and congressmen. Thats the 1st step.

[el-jefe]

I have too much ambition.

[el-jefe]

Or were you telling me in an indirect way to become a politician. (they live off our tax dollars also).

[el-jefe]

http://newsbuckit.blogspot.com/2007/02/seven-words-you-can-never-say-on.html

courtesy of Coach Gill.

[fuzzy]

For the record, I think Terry is an idiot. I cannot stand his type.

Yeah Terry we know, you've done this and that and the other thing. Your grammer is much better then everyone elses, so much so that you cannot bother reading the substance of an argument against you because the grammer is so wrong that you cant understand what is being said.

The PDGA is a much better place without you having any real say so. Now only if people could get the rest of the backward ass thinkers who run shit over there out I might actually consider being a part of that org.

Man i cant wait til i am eligible to win the 60-64 year old world title..then the 65-69 title...then the 70-74 title... then the 75-79 title etc etc.....With all those 1-2 person divisions i am bound to have a shot at a world title someday.
-----------------------------------------------

BTW, i propose that at league yall follow the PDGA ways and have a 29 year old single father with a bum shoulder and bad leg division. Put it on the next meeting agenda.

[el-jefe]

ha ha ha, I knew you would chime in at some point.
We all know Fuzzy is far from a right winger and he thinks he is an idiot. I bet he got the reactions he did by baiting or just plain idiocy. :)